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Welcome to the show. I’m tony martignetti, the aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent hopefully recall last week i had sashadichter in the studio, sasha is in charge of business development for acumen fund he’s, a popular blogger and speaker, and we talked about how acumen is work and his own personal body of work can help your non-profit and your career this week. It’s legislative lookout and opportunity with federal lobbyist perry wasserman, managing director of five o one see strategies will examine what congress is debating that hits home for you. Is the charitable deduction at risk what’s the fate of the ira charitable roll over? What are continuing resolutions, and why are they killing important non-profit programs? Our second segment? Scott koegler, our regular tech contributor and the editor of non-profit technology news, will be back with us and he’s going to look at whether you should take the plunge and develop a smartphone app for your non-profit scott will explain what it takes and how to get you started. That’s legislative lookout and opportunity this show on tony’s take two at thirty two minutes after the hour work at home moms rock my own experience hiring work at home moms to help me in my business has been terrific. I blogged about it, and i’ll say a little about that on tony’s. Take two in between our two guests. Of course, right now, we take a break, and after this break, i’ll be joined by federal lobbyist perry wasserman. Stay with us. E-giving anything tooting, getting tempting. You’re listening to the talking, alternate network, waiting to get into thinking. Nothing. You could. Is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? 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Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back to tony martignetti non-profit radio. My guest now is perry wasserman perry is managing director of five o one see strategies, a washington, d c based lobbying firm that works exclusively with non-profit organizations. His clients have included guidestar, national council of non-profits and the partnership for philanthropic planning. Since co founding five oh one. See strategies in two thousand five, perry has worked on every major piece of federal legislation that affects america’s charities. Before beginning his work as a federal lobbyists, he served as special assistant for government relations at legal services corporation, a congressional e chartered non-profit organization. So he has that great in non-profit and outside non-profit as a consultant dual experience. I’m very glad that perry’s work and his practice and is business five. Oh one. See, strategies. Bring him to the show. Perry, welcome. Hi, tony. Thanks for you. I’m very well, thanks for thanks for being with us. Thank you. Um, perry, let’s. Start with the charitable deduction, which is something that’s been sacred for a long time and doesn’t seem to be so any longer. What is congress talking about? With respect to the charitable deduction? Sure. Well, a cz. You indicated i think a lot of people consider the charitable deduction toe always be a sacred cow in washington, and that is unfortunately changing it’s uh, it’s under attack, so to speak, the president’s budget president obama’s budget that he delivers to congress once again included a proposal that would permanently limit the value of itemize deductions, which includes the charitable deduction for certain taxpayers. It calls for a twenty eight percent cap on itemized deductions for individuals earning over two hundred thousand a year. That was twenty elearning twenty eight percent. Is that right? Twenty eight percent? Okay? And, of course, the this notion of a limit is somewhat new. Under the current law, most taxpayers wouldn’t hit a limit unless they gave a significant amount to charity. So it’s certainly cause for concern the change just to kind of give you an idea of how much money would raise it’s estimated that making that change that adding that cab would raise three hundred twenty billion dollars a year. So it’s it’s a big ticket item, and it’s it’s something that a lot of people in washington a lot of policymakers air looking at in the context of course of deficit reduction and, increasingly, tax reform and an overhaul of the tax code. There’s also, the president also has a commission looking into deficit issues, fiscal responsibility issues, and they issued a report last year which would actually call for a new elimination of the charitable deduction on they would replace it with a essentially a twelve percent tax credit, which taxpayers would only get forgiving above two percent of the adjusted gross income. So that would even be a more severe on change from from the and these are both obama budget proposals. So are they in congress yet or where would they, where would they reside when they end up in congress? Right? Well, the budget proposal is document essentially, that the president delivers to congress each year it’s kind of a blueprint for how, you know, things should move forward. Uh, the second, a proposal that i spoke about from the president’s commission. Actually, i’m going to be introduced as separate legislation in congress. But the larger issue is that the two tax writing committees, the senate finance committee, over on the senate side in the house ways and means committee over on the health side our act osili engaged in the beginning stages of tax reform, so they’re looking tio basically institute a overhaul of the tax code similar to what took place in nineteen, eighty six. So as they’re doing that, these proposals are kind of on the table and it’s something that ah, latto charities are keeping a close eye on you, and you used the word overhaul. So it is significant tax reform legislation that’s at least under consideration, and so it seems like aa lot of things are on the table that haven’t been before or haven’t been for a long time, absolutely in the broadest terms senate democrats, house republicans and even the president of some some extent are basically calling for streamlining of the tax code. They want a lower tax rates, they want to reduce or eliminate many tax breaks so everything’s on the table and the charitable deduction is a big ticket item and given what are no countries facing in terms of the economy right now, it’s going to continue to get a lot of scrutiny from members of congress. Perry, we have just about a minute before our first break, what are we moved? To the to the a question about the scope of tax exemption and then we’ll cover it. Mohr after this break. Sure. Well, a tax exemption is another issue. Another kind of big ticket item that members of congress are looking at in just the past few weeks. Actually, senator grassley, who was formerly the chairman and ranking member of the senate finance committee. Now he remains a influential member of the finance committee. And as many of your list there’s probably no he’s kind of the self anointed charity watchdog in congress. He is actually called for a new examination of how much the taxing kemp shin that’s a pretty basic term, you know, non-profits receiving tax exemption, how much that cost the federal government. And it may seem like somewhat of a benign act, maybe he’s just trying to get some numbers. But again, for people who, you know, work on these issues and watch this stuff every day, it has true significance. And a lot of people are starting to think about what senator grassley’s act his request might mean, yeah, all right. We’re going to look at this more after the break. That’s huge the question. Of tax exempt status. How much does that cost? And if if they’re looking at it as a cost, what that may mean for its its continuation or its reform. My guest is perry wasserman, federal lobbyist, managing director of five o one. See strategies, and perry will stay with us after his break. I hope you do, too. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. 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If only i had someone to help me with my lifestyle. I feel like giving up. Is this you mind over matter, health and fitness can help. If you’re expecting an epiphany, chances are it’s not happening. Mind over matter, health and fitness could help you get back on track or start a new life and fitness. Join Joshua margolis, fitness expert at 2 one two, eight sixty five nine to nine xero. Or visit w w w died mind over matter. N y c dot com you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Welcome back to the show on with federal lobbyist perry wasserman and before the break we were talking about the scope of the tax exemption, just the existence of tax exempt status and senator grassley’s enquiries about how how much that might cost. This is s o i understand very your point when, when he starts looking at things than people get concerned. But this is ah different way of looking at that tax exemption. Isn’t it as a cost? Exactly what what? Essentially maybe behind grassley’s request is a natelec to paige the tax exemption itself, a cz what we call in washington attacks, expenditure and attacks expenditure is a term that, you know, perhaps you, tony and many of your listeners are not familiar with but basically tax expenditures airways that the federal government spend through the tax code it’s the way that they kind of achieved policy priority to the tax code. The most popular example of, you know, the most well known example of ah, tax expenditures, the the home mortgage interest deduction one that hits more close to home, of course, might be the charitable deduction. That’s also attacks expenditure tax expenditures right now are becoming heavily disfavored in washington, they cost a lot of money. They’re not subject to annual review. A lot of them have just been added to the code year after year and nobody’s really looking at these things. So the thinking, maybe, is that, as senator grassley starts teo, look into this. This cost of the tax exemption, it may be in an attempt to paige it as a tax expenditure, and certainly not get rid of the entire tax exemption system. The senator has actually gone on the record as saying that certainly not his attempt, but to look into maybe some of the segments of entity and see if there’s some way to define them on at risk of kind of oversimplifying it. A lot of people talk about this debate of so called good charities versus bad charities in the one area where we think. Policymakers may start is in the fee for service segment of the non profit sector. We certainly know that buy-in that policy makers have been interested in universities and hospitals and credit unions, increasingly software companies that have non-profit status. So that may be where they start. Okay, now, senator grassley is not the ranking republican or he’s. Not sorry, i think that’s wrong he’s not the minority leader any longer, but he still has a lot of power on the senate finance committee. Yeah, he’s, no longer the ranking republican on the finance. There was kind of a, you know, a shuffle after the last election, and he has taken the ranking spot on the judiciary committee. But as i said, he’s still remains on finance. He’s, obviously, senior member hey worked very closely with the chairman of the finance committee, senator baucus, from montana. So he is definitely continuing to play the role that really he’s played since two thousand for in-kind of looking into the sector. And what about senator orrin hatch, who is the the minority leader on the senate finance committee? What’s his general take on non-profits sure, senator hatch eyes the ranking republican on the committee, he, too, works very closely with senator baucus. They have a good working relationship on some of the specific reform issues that grassley has been pushing. We’re not quite sure where senator hatch stands as of yet it’s, still early in the session, but certainly he’s supportive of the of the sector, is a lot of great non-profits in his state that i know he works very closely with. So we’re really hoping he will kind of continue, you know, in this supportive role and hope we turn into a real champion for the nonprofit sector in minutes. Okay, so just very interesting, you know, that the charitable deduction and the and the scope of tax exemption on a new way of looking at that all. Sort of uncharted ground, but could be could be serious. Well, serious implications for the charitable sector, do you do you get that there’s much support for let’s the questioning of the scope of the tax exemption? Or is it really just senator grassley at this point investigating and you don’t see or hear of others interested in the same area? Yeah, i mean, that’s a great question at this point, i would say in terms of getting of cost, you know, pegging a cost to the tax exemption, it does look like it’s coming right from senator grassley. I’m not personally aware of any other members of the senate or the house for that matter that he’s consulted with, but the feeling now is, uh, that they really was just like numbers so they can decide what to do, and certainly, you know, we have advocates for the sector. We’re not afraid of the facts and what the numbers might show, but we have to be very hyre careful to make sure that those numbers aren’t misinterpret in any way that could eventually hurt the sector, there are on enormous amount of hearings going on dealing with these tax reform issues actually, senator baucus, the chairman of the senate finance committee, has pledged to hold a hearing on tax reform every single week that the senate’s in session this year. So we’re going to see a lot of this on right now, we’re just in the beginning of it, and we’re tryingto, you know, get out, you know, figure out what’s going on. But the key point is that both the charitable deduction and potentially even tax exemption issues, particularly in the fee for service segment of the non profit sector, are clearly on the table and carry your work. Just to give people a little behind the scenes is to go to all these hearings and monitor and what else, right? I represent a number of clients, mostly national, nonprofit organizations that care about, uh, issues that specifically pertain to the non profit sector. Things like charitable giving things like non-profit advocacy writes the ability of tax exempt organizations to actually go out and lobby themselves to comment on legislation and regulations, things like that as well as budget and appropriation issues. Those are the types of issues that i work on, so my job is tio you know, help clients develop their policy positions, put those positions in materials that policymakers can understand and will appreciate, and then advocate for those positions on the hill through actual direct lobbying on sometimes grassroots lobbying. And then a lot of what i do is just kind of communicate information there’s so much going on on capitol hill and in the federal agencies that a big part of my job. It’s just get information to teo my clients. I’m with perry, wasserman and he’s, managing director of five o one see strategies, which you’ll find at five oh one see strategies dot com and that c is in eyes in parentheses. Five oh one see strategies dot com, harry the ira charitable rollover let’s, let’s talk about that. It was renewed for two thousand eleven. Where does that stand for beyond two thousand eleven? Sure. Well, exactly. The irony tribal roll over is i would say probably the most popular e-giving incentive right now, non-profits of all sizes air using this this vehicle, so to speak, to raise on enormous amount of funds, which is great news. It was enacted first in two thousand six. It was extended a couple. Times. And where we are now is that a is in law through the end of this year. So the the incentive will expire at the end of twenty eleven. There is, as there has been for the past few years, a tremendous push to, uh, extend and expand the rollover past the end of this year. There’s actually, legislation pending in the senate. Which would permanently extend miree charitable roll over it would lift the hundred thousand dollars cap on direct gifts which exists now um it would also allow certain types of cram giving to begin when the individual when the donor reaches age fifty nine and a half and the other thing the bill would do interestingly it would allow miree rollovers be made teo different types of entities besides public charities that would allow the gifts to go to dahna advise funds to supporting organizations and to private foundations all of which were not included in the original roll over that has since been extended since two thousand six so that legislation is pending in the senate we hope to have a companion bill in the house soon and then what we’re going to do is work to drum of this much support for those two bills as possible and hopefully when tax legislation starts to move the idea the way it works is that we try to get our provisions attached to that bigger bill and see if we can get it signed into law the biggest difficulty we face is that, like everything, it cost money, that change is going to cost the federal government money because it will be for going tax revenue, so that makes it difficult. That’s usually the biggest obstacle we face, but we’re going to keep pushing to see if we can get it extended past two thousand eleven doesn’t become the charitable communities role then too, find a way teo to pay for it, or at least offer suggestions for how to pay for it. Or is that really beyond what? What ah, lobbyist can do or what the community it would be expected to do that that’s advocating for something that those cost money? Yeah, well, that’s, that’s really a great question because it’s something that we face all the time, our position is that we’re pushing the bill. We’re pushing thie idea to extend and expand the ira rollover it’s not our job to come up with ways to pay for it. Those air discussions that we sometimes have with staffers, but the fear is that in order to raise revenue, they would tinker with the tax code as it relates to the non-profit community and that’s certainly. Something we wouldn’t want to see way wouldn’t want to make changes so we can get this provision passed into law. So really, our focus is to drum up a much support as we can. And then as we get closer down the line, um, you know, we start to look at what are called pay for his ways, actually raise revenue and usually that’s a staff level discussion it’s not something that were directly involved with but it’s certainly something we have to be aware of. And i would just add in the that any of your listeners, if they can call their senators and asked him to co sponsor the bill, that would be a huge help. The legislation is f five five seven it’s called the public good miree rollover asked there’s about nine senators. I believe that our honest co sponsors right now, but we need many more. So it be great if people can can call their senators support and in the ongoing effort, if the community wants to participate, is there one of the one of your clients? Maybe that whose list they should be on, or how can people in an ongoing effort you know, if you need to support four months from now, find out about that, right? Well, there’s i mean, there’s a number of ah, particularly national organizations that are working on these issues. The partnership for philanthropic planning, their website is p p p net and dot org on day work on charitable giving issues. Certainly independent sector is kind of the umbrella organization that works on a lot of these different types of issues. They have a lot of great news, national council non-profits also working on these issues. I mean, there’s a lot of people in the field right now who are working on those issues that affect every single non-profit on dh, they have a lot of great sources that i think people should kind of check out. We’re running a little short of time just have about two minutes left, and i wanted teo ask you about continuing resolutions and and how those are hurting some important non-profit programs first, what? So we’ll keep you out of jargon jail because twenty martignetti non-profit was jug in jail, and i’m the self appointed ward not here to see you in their behind bars. What is a continuing resolution. Well, a continuing resolution, our cr i’s basically a short term stopgap way of funding the government. And this week actually, congress clear the city continuing resolution of the fiscal year to fund the government. The idea is that, uh, lawmakers can come to an agreement. They want to avoid a government shutdown. So they just passed the short term continuing resolution kind of like a status quo type situation, essentially the sea ours that have pass so far funding the government for this current fiscal year that we’re in at last year’s level. But in addition to that, they are making billions of dollars in cut on dh. Those cuts include some important non-profit programs, right? Absolutely. The, um, this current continuing resolution actually contains about six billion dollars in cuts. Those cuts are going toe all different types of agencies that funds programs, a lot of which non-profits are the recipients of those cuts also include a tremendous amount of what’s generally referred to his earmarks, but basically it’s just spending that’s directed by congress on a lot of those funds go to non-profit organization. So it’s it’s, not an effort that is specifically targeted at non-profits but because the government, uh, is being funded this way, not through the traditional channels, the traditional appropriations process which have hearings and committee reports and all these different avenues where people can get involved and try to influence legislation because they’re they’re funding it with the short term see ours groups non-profits that don’t have particularly sophisticated lobbying mechanisms in place or kind of shut out of the process and there also facing these large cuts so it’s really something that i think you know, we’re going to see how this plays out. We’re going to see the effects of it in the months on year to come, but it’s certainly a reality in washington right now we have to stop there. We need to have you back on the show because there are other things that i was hoping to talk about. Good thank you i’d love to have you back. My guest has been perry washington he’s, the managing director of five o one see strategies, which you’ll find at five oh one see strategies dot com and he’s, a well informed federal lobbyist. Perry, thank you very much for being on the show. Thanks for having been a pleasure, we’ll take a break after this break. Tony’s. Take two work at home moms rock yeah, you’re listening to the talking alternative network. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio treyz non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio friday’s one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting do you want to enhance your company’s web presence with an eye catching and unique website design? 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Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com dafs welcome back, it’s, time for tony’s take two this week work at home moms rock i blogged this week about my experience hiring three women who are working home mom’s carry christine and tracy, and of course, i go into detail on the block, but the point that i want to make now is that work at home moms have been, in my experience conscientious, zealous workers, hard workers, detail oriented. You just have to be a little flexible because they do have kids at home but that’s no greater flexibility. I don’t think then you have to be around every other person who works in an office. I mean, people in offices have constraints, they have meetings, they have lunch time s so when it’s a work at home mom instead of lunch time and maybe naptime that you’re working around. So i mean, i haven’t found the constraints to be really that much different. They’re just sort of different labels, and i’ve found the moms who do work for me, who work from home to be really, as i said, conscientious and just outstanding helpers in helping me tow grow my business, so take a look at that. Block, of course, my block is that m p g a d v dot com and the post is called work at home moms rock also just wanna remind you that we are on itunes. We’ve been there for a while. You can subscribe download. Listen on the device of your choice, whether that’s a computer or a smartphone, a tablet, whatever you can subscribe to the show, listen anytime and that’s at non-profit radio dot net and that is tony’s take two for friday, march eighteenth. I’m joined now by our recurring and well informed tech consultant, tech contributor, the editor of non-profit technology news. I’m talking, of course about scott koegler scott, how are you? Welcome, i’m doing well, thanks to you well, too, thank you. Good to have you back. We’re going to talk about opportunity a p p p or to nitti after two nitti should you take the plunge and develop a smartphone app for you? Non-profit scott, of course, is i said editor of non-profit technology news, which you’ll find at n p tech news. Dot com scott for those who may not know, there probably are still some people. What is an app? That’s a really good question tony and after is a short for application, of course, and african used to mean a computer program today, the’s things reside on smartphones at the iphone is actually the originator of the term map, although they that the abbreviations been around for a long time. But applications could run anything from a very complex program that is downloaded and installed on the device that the iphone, the, the smartphone, whatever device you may be using to simply i link to a web page that shows up on especially formatted to fit and work properly on the device so there’s a whole gamut there. Can you give us a couple of examples of how non-profits are using aps? Sure, the simplest one is actually just having a link page that was formatted to their website. We had a better article on p tech news couple weeks ago and there’s a couple of examples there. One of them is probably pretty well known to folks that are there your listeners and that’s npr npr as a whole series of applications that are just beautifully done, and they range anywhere from show updates, articles, the segment, the articles just as they would on their website into categories. And by time, they also have aps that link you to their podcasts. Now the podcasts come down through the way of the itunes store, which actually is the way all the apse get onto yours, your iphone devices or your ios devices. Um, but that’s, that’s a really good example. Just take a look at, you know, for those with an iphone or an iowa, which means yeah, i’ll catch you on thie apple apple operating system that runs on the iphone and the ipad. Okay, that’s what ios means, right? Okay, bond, we do know from sources that i am not at liberty to reveal that national public radio actually is striving to be more like talking alternative broadcasting, which is yes, i can’t reveal, but we do have an app for that talking alternative can be heard on and that’s tune in radio it’s one app and has many station so it’s, not ours, but it does include our stream on dh sew, sew, sew your example is a perfect one, i think, because that is a sensible app for an organisation like national public radio here’s where you can find our streams and here’s our show schedule so sort of the lesson there maybe, is that the cap needs to be relevant to the people who are your constituents, right? Absolutely it’s it’s another way to stay in touch with your constituents with those folks you hope to be constituents and it’s i think the point is really just like any kind of publishing or publication, the what’s important is the content. So if you have information that’s relevant and interesting to the people that you’re addressing, they will be not only interested in installing the app but also going back to it. You know, there are how many’s two hundred fifty thousand dafs just in the itunes store and then there’s all of the tall, the the google aps and, you know, there’s getting to be an increasing number of blackberry aps, so if it gets to be very, very confusing and so you’re you’re competing with a lot of, well, what a competition. So you you need to be relevant and available? Yeah, we’ll talk in a few minutes about how to promote your app on get it, get it seen among these hundreds. Of thousands. So so it sounds like if you were going to develop a nap for your non-profit that you develop it for a particular type of phone. So you do it for the iphone or for the blackberry. Is that how it works? Um, that’s a good question, of course, the iphone might now have a majority of of users, though that’s the thing pretty quick with the android devices that are coming out and all the different kinds of variations there? Uh, ideally, what you want to do is have one after that is able to run on anyone of basically those three platforms, and there are companies that will do that. I don’t i don’t exactly know which ones do that, but i do know that it is becoming easier to do their cem some applications platforms that are provided by adobe corporation, people make photo shop and ah, and, uh, acrobat and those kind of things they are able to kind of, you know, take one application and make it playable on multiple kinds of devices, but okay, and the three platforms that you alluded to, the three platforms are our iphone, blackberry and android correct? Okay, the most popular smartphones, right? And those seven phone operating systems coming oppa’s well, i don’t know if you know that windows phone seven platform will be replacing the nokia software application. Is that running okay? Songs, which are, you know, amazingly prevalent. Kind all over the world, but that’ll be a while before that happens, so they’re actually are for major plan how to look at. Okay, so if you if you think you have an idea that’s that may be engaging that’s really, your point is, you know you want to engage your constituents, what’s the first thing you should look at if you if you think you want to developing an app for your non-profit i say the first do is to look around and search the adjusting applications, see if something similar to it, if there’s one competing with it, or if there’s one that you might even be able to piggyback on, some of these applications have been developed for specific company, while some of them are fairly generic and could be repurposed. In other words, the provider i developed a kind of a shell for an application, and for some may be reduced amount of money, they could be able to revise it so that it’s specific to yours. So look around and see what’s out there, and if any of them are are pertinent to what you’re trying to do, you know, there’s also it could be a little bit of cleverness built into aps. I know i’m a zipcar member and on the zipcar app, they’ve added something that i don’t think really is necessary but it’s cute you khun beep the horn of your car using their app beaconfire well, i guess yeah doesn’t mean, i guess it could have that practical purpose, too, and you could certainly unlock your car, but i just there there are other examples to it just being as well as engaging, just being a little clever. Bradrick and i think that is finding out what it is you probably already have some constituency, you have an email list, young people that come to your website, you might just put up there in an article that sense, considering developing and after for mobile devices, what do you need? You know, it’s surprising what people will tell you, and i would imagine that your example, the zip car was probably generated by somebody who was frustrated because there were six zip cars in the parking lot. They don’t know which one was their’s. I’m with scott koegler our regular tech contributor, we’re going to take a break and when we return. We’ll continue our conversation opportunity. Talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Dahna i really need to take better care of myself. If only i had someone to help me with my lifestyle. I feel like giving up. Is this you mind over matter, health and fitness can help. If you’re expecting an epiphany, chances are it’s not happening. 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We’re talking about opportunity with our regular tech contributor, scott koegler scott, about the cost of doing this. It seems like it could be a little costly endeavor and that’s exactly why i remember you look around and see if there’s something out there that you could make use of right, because it’s not get down to it is programming that were to cost wanted in this pasta posting your application, you’re apt to the eiffel store to the android or whatever those are, i guess, almost negligible when you get down to a few hundred dollars. But the bigger cost is actually development of the program and it’s not really possible to put a number on that because they’re so widely based on what your purpose is. But yes, it can get very expensive. Yeah, you’re paying for program or time, but your article on the subject has some ideas about reducing that cost right, i would say. You know, you want teo to see if your community has any programming capability. You never know who your constituents are. Really so possibly make people out there have done this or know how to do it for our program. Would just like to donate either the time or or just make a financial donation to get the work done. Also seems like it could be maybe a good project for ah, computer science. College intern. Sure. Any of those programming task? Um, you know, take you see if you can take advantage of somebody’s educational experience and maybe they can do it is a project for class for maybe they just need experience and, you know, they never never downplay the the ability to get somebody else’s name exposed. So if you have, for instance, student or someone just aspiring to be a programmer or to create applications like this, just putting their name on every users phone, you know, could be incentive enough for them to do that. And after you’ve done this, then how about trying to get your kapin recognized among the hundreds of thousands that are out there? Yep. Good point. The main. Yeah, the main way i would see it is just the social networking, the networking that you already have in place. In other words, let your constituency no in the same methods used to let them know about other things. So if it’s female shoot it out in an e mail, if it’s on facebook uh, certainly put on facebook that you got it there, i don’t know if we talked about something called q r codes. Now, why don’t you go ahead? Cukor codes, why don’t you explain what these are? Okay? And i’m going to be in jargon jail here because i don’t know what you are, but i do ok, i’ll let you out. I wish i had a set of keys because i would jingle them for your funny little cerini barcode think it’s got a bunch of little dots and a little square you are, and the purpose of it is you can put that on a website or you can even print it. I have one in the back of my business card and people can aim there their smartphone at it, and the smart phone will read that and automatically go out and do whatever. That q r code instructs in this case it would be to actually download the app so it makes a real simple. They don’t type anything, and they just point the phone at click the picture and off they go in, they downloaded it makes it really, really simple. Q r stands for quick response, right? Yeah. Quick response, of course. And i see them on the sides of buses in new york city. Like scott said you, you either snap it. What? Will you take a picture of it? In some cases or in others you can use your barcode scanner, which would be an app. You have an app that scans barcodes and that will that will recognize the he’s black and white diagrams that that bring you somewhere. I even used them in my in my seminars at the end, when i want people to know where they confined all my seminar slides, which is at my blogged i have ah, q r code direct them to the block. So coming. Prevalent? Yeah, they are actually it’s. Interesting. They were originally developed for industrial use. Factory manufacturing. T get machines to operate in a certain way at a certain time, but it’s so so your point is you could use the q r code to get your constituents two download your your new app. Absolutely, and you can use the cure echoes for other things as you just pointed out as well. But again, getting your app noticed is just like getting anything else noticed. You you let your people know, ask them to spread the word. And if you if you’ve done the first piece of magic, which is it’s something that’s useful and interesting and people want to use, then they’re going to tell people about it. So, uh, you know, it’s, self propagating, hopefully, yeah. And i was going to emphasize the point you just did is having something that’s useful, clever and related to your charitable mission. I mean, this is what the people who your constituents love you for. They love you for your charitable work. It’s got to be related to the charitable mission. And i should say one thing about some applications in particular. And i think when a lot of folks think of non-profit applications were perhaps they they go directly to the e-giving function. So in other words, you want to be able to bring up on an app that lets me make a donation come? Unfortunately, apple has said that you can’t do that, so that leaves out the entire ios platform. You cannot actually take donations through an ad, which is there’s a whole movement behind getting rid of that restriction. So, as you might imagine, yeah, but i could see a way around it, maybe if if, if a non-profit had maybe a relationship with certain stores, and maybe the app could be to find those that the nearest one of those stores where if you buy something, maybe coffee at starbucks or whatever a portion goes back to the charity, so maybe it could be like a locator sure, that would be a great application would be something to be fun and, you know, everybody drinks coffee, and we’re at least a lot of us drink coffee, so yeah, that would be something to pursue. All right, sky drinkwater, she’s got okay. I’m really not a coffee drinker, but most people do. I know i’m in the vast minority vast minority i’ve been with scott koegler and he’s, our regular tech contributor and he’s. The editor of non-profit technology news, which is that n p tech news dot com scott, thanks very much for talking about opportunity. Thanks a lot, tony. My pleasure to have you back again soon. Next week, i’m looking it’s time to check back with our recruiter, paula marks and non-profit job seeker leonora to hear how the search is going and what advice paula has four leonora, that advice could help your next job search whether it’s going on now or yet to come, and i hope you’ll listen next week. I want to thank my guests again, perry wasserman and scott koegler for being with me this week, you can keep up with what’s coming up on tony martignetti non-profit radio by signing up for our insider email alerts on our facebook page, facebook and then just go to our to the show name and while you’re there, click like become a fan of the show, you can subscribe to itunes. Listen anytime, download the show. Listen on the device of your choice that is at non-profit radio dot net. Our creative producer is claire meyerhoff, line producer and owner of talking alternative broadcasting. 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