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Welcome to the show, this is tony martignetti non-profit radio big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent of your aptly named host on february third, two thousand twelve. I hope you were with me last week. I sincerely hope so because then you would have heard looking at giving two thousand eleven and two thousand twelve. Rob mitchell, ceo of atlas of giving, was with me last week to talk about two thousand eleven’s giving by sector source and state. We also looked ahead to predictions for this year, and it was breaking the mold in traditional endowment design from the national conference on philanthropic planning last week, katherine miree, consultant and attorney attorney barry looked at alternatives to endowment design that are rooted in lawsuits, law changes and difficulties implementing donor for pus is that have arisen with the way endowments are traditionally set up this week, entrepreneurs onboard and starting the plan giving conversation first up, entrepreneurs are under utilized on boards and jerry stengel, founder of venture near we’ll help you make the fix. Who are they? How do you find them? And how do you approach them to get their special talents on your board and starting the plan e-giving conversation. Laurie greiff, president of breakthrough philanthropy, encourages you to start the plan giving conversation with your committed prospects and donors, and this was pre recorded at last year’s national philanthropy day, hosted by westchester county chapter of afb association of fund-raising professionals between the guests has always tony’s take two on my block this week, my next-gen charity, two thousand eleven interviews, part for innovation, the journey and motivation in three different videos. We’re live tweeting the show this week. Use the hashtag non-profit radio to join the conversation with us on twitter. The show is supported by g grace corporate real estate services. I’m grateful for their support. I really am right now. We take a break and when we returned entrepreneurs onboard, so stay with me. You’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you suffering from aches and pains? Has traditional medicine let you down? Are you tired of taking toxic medications, then come to the double diamond wellness center and learn how our natural methods can help you to hell? Call us now at to one to seven to one eight, one eight three that’s to one to seven to one eight one eight three or find us on the web at www dot double diamond wellness dot com. We look forward to serving you. Is your marriage in trouble? Are you considering divorce? Hello, i’m lawrence bloom, a family law attorney in new york and new jersey. No one is happier than the day their divorce is final. My firm can help you. We take the nasty out of the divorce process and make people happy. Police call a set to one, two, nine six four three five zero two for a free consultation. That’s lawrence h bloom two, one two, nine, six, four, three five zero two. We make people happy. Hyre hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com. Welcome back to big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent on tony martignetti non-profit radio, i guess now is jerry stengel. We’re going to talk about entrepreneurs on board. Jerry is the founder of venture near offering social enterprises non-profits and small businesses. Advice from a professional advisors and piers with real world experience. I’m very pleased that her work and her thoughts about entrepreneurs on board boards brings her back to the show. Jerry, welcome, welcome. I’m glad to be here. It’s a pleasure in the studio this time. First time was we did a panel at the you were you were talking about linked in at the national philanthropy day at the f b westchester? Absolutely. And i’m going to touch on lincoln again today. Okay? Ah ah. Now i know why. So let’s talk about entrepreneurs on dh. Maybe that’ll have something to do with how to find them. But what are we talking about? Who are we? What is the universe? Who? Let’s define entrepreneurs. So in this particular case, i’m just talking about small business owners. So they made have ah, company that has a hundred employees or a handful of employees, but they’re running the operation and managing a business and growing it. And what do these people have that special offer? Two boards? Well, they have a lot in common with the non-profit ceo and one is that they have a fire in their belly. So justus, the non-profit ceo, is passionate about the mission of their non-profit the entrepreneur is very, very passionate about their business, they are creative problem solvers, so they seen up obstacle, they go around it under it, and sometimes even through it, they are also resourceful. So justus, the non-profit ceo, does mohr for less, so doesn’t entrepreneur. So this instance, somebody that’s going toe, you know, say, spend a gazillion dollars on marketing, and they also have a lot of technical expertise, so you’re non-profit may need somebody who’s good at finance, somebody who’s good at logistics air operations, you might turn to somebody from the manufacturing industry or perhaps your non-profit has a lot of customer service people, and you need to do a lot of training. You might need somebody from the service industry, so you’re going to turn to non-profit not non-profits two entrepreneurs for a variety of reasons, these people are running businesses though small, medium or large? Aren’t they too busy to contribute to a board? So they absolutely are very, very busy, and one of the things that i think is critical when you are talking. Teo are trying to recruit an entrepreneur, and really, this would be for anybody is to spell out how much time what is the time commitment? So how many board meetings do you have? What is thie attendants expectation? Do you have to be on committees? How many times does the committee meet? How long are those meetings? Do you throw a lot of special events and expect your board members to be there? Okay, so we’ll and we’ll get into the setting the expectations, which is sort of what you’re what you’re scratching it, but so you’re confident that even though these air busy people, they’ll if they believe in your work, they’ll carve out time for you? Absolutely, they actually think that giving back it is important to their own success and it’s the right thing to dio so fidelity gift funded a survey last year, and they found that entrepreneurs, um, believe a majority of them that their success is tied to doing good work, but they’re underutilized on boards you feel non-profits don’t recruit them sufficiently don’t pay enough attention, right? So i think that non-profits need more board members and need board members that have business expertise and technical expertise, and they can seek out entrepreneurs as one type of person that would be appropriate for their board. But so why do you suppose they’re there under under? I don’t know if underappreciated is right, but underutilized in in, in looking at who should be boardmember czar non-profits no reluctant to approach them because then we feel they’re so busy, or is there something else going on? How come we’re not paying enough attention to them? So i think that there are in large corporations, some large corporations actually do training teo, help up and coming managers get onto boards and it’s a way of training them as a cz leaders. So i think lord xu corporation’s think mohr about making sure that there people are giving back in this particular way, so they’re pro actively looking for places to put there up and coming managers s oh, it’s a pse much of the corporation reaching out. To the non-profit to the non-profit is the non-profit thinking about it, they also will make sure that they’re people are listed in the resource is that are available. Teo find ah, perspective board members so there’s there’s more outreach on the corporate side, entrepreneurs there not really thinking about doing this, but you’re confident that if if we come to them, if the non-profit comes to them with the idea that they’ll be receptive? Absolutely and there’s one organization that actually is proactively trying to get entrepreneurs on two boards and that’s a palindrome, they’re based in silicon valley, and they are trying to get hi tech buy-in entrepreneurs onto non-profit boards, and they work with them on setting expectations and even talking about what the roles and responsibilities will bake. And just very briefly before break what’s that website pal drone advisors and that’s a good question palindrome advisers dot org’s i’m going to say, pal a drone p a l d i and a p a l d i n r o m a advise talent palindrome palindrome, same like otto is a palindrome, same backwards and forwards. Okay, this is auto martignetti we’re going to take a break. And when we returned, of course, jerry strangle stays with me, and i hope you do, too. Co-branding think dick tooting getting ding, ding, ding ding. You’re listening to the talking alternate network, itching to get anything. Duitz cubine are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Oppcoll hi, this is psychic medium. Betsy cohen, host of the show. The power of intuition. Join me at talking alternative that calm mondays at eleven a. M call in for a free psychic reading. Learn how to tune into your intuition to feel better and to create your optimum life. I’m here to guide you and to assist you in creating life that you deserve. Listen every monday at eleven a, m on talking alternative dot com. Are you feeling overwhelmed and the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics, politically expressed, i and montgomery taylor and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt y at r l j media. Dot com talking alternative radio twenty four hours a day. Hi, i’m kate piela, executive director of dance, new amsterdam. And you’re listening to tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent. Welcome back to the show. Always big non-profit ideas. Well, you just heard that. Okay, big non-profit ages for the other ninety five percent. Thank you, kate paler for doing that dropped for us, jerry. I surveyed the listeners before the show and won. The questions was, do you have any entrepreneurs on your board and only one third do and two thirds don’t and one of the other questions wass if not so for the for the two thirds that don’t have you ever tried to recruit on entrepreneur, dear board? And yes, to two thirds of those had indeed, so people have largely trying, but on ly a third of the listeners who answered the pole actually have entrepreneurs on board on their board, but you’re saying, you know, fire in the belly and these people are resourceful and and problem solvers, but that could sound like they might be a little troublemaker like they’re goingto they’re gonna push to fast. They’re going to move things too quickly. Entrepreneurs maybe push things fast on that’s a good thing for non-profits so sometimes non-profits khun move a little bit slowly and the impatience of small business owner can get them off the dime so i don’t see that i don’t see the downside in that way. We could use him. We could use some stirring up. Yeah. Okay. How about just in terms of their ah, they’re giving aren’t entrepreneurs have they rank generosity, life? So this is really, really fascinating. Entrepreneurs will give personally, and they’ll also give through their company when they give through their company. The rate at which they give is twice as much the rate of a large corporations giving oh, twice as much twice as much per cent to twice okay. And this is when they’re on a board or we don’t know whether this is on a board or not. I don’t know whether it’s on a board or not. So this is again that survey that i was talking about that was done by fidelity gift fund was anything else interesting in that in that survey about entrepreneurs before we go further about getting them on, i’m going to say that it really is the belief from the entrepreneur that it’s part of them it’s part of their success. It’s the reason they’re goingto do well is giving back okay, but it’s also interesting, then too correlate that with what you said earlier about them not really reaching out as much to non-profits as employees in corporations, or as as corporations do for their employees. So the entrepreneurs feel this, but maybe they don’t know how to get started. They may not know how to get started and the non-profit may not know howto reach them, so i think it’s a two way street here. So it’s both you know, if i were talking to a group of entrepreneurs, i would be talking about the benefits of being on a board to an entrepreneur. So as an entrepreneur, i know that i don’t have a lot of role models to say when i’ve been on a board i’ve seen first hand my board members in action, they become my role models, i get to learn leadership from my fellow boardmember soak if the my audience were entrepreneurs, that’s what i would be plugging and again before we get to the non-profit breaking down that wall on dh starting approach entrepreneurs don’t you say a little more about your own experience on aboard? What board you’re on? How that’s been, so i’ve been on a variety of boards. I was on the new york city chapter and the national association of women business owners for eight years for i don’t know for six years i was the vice chair of governance matters, which is non-profit advocacy group for better governance, so the better you govern the mohr good you’re going to be doing, and i’m now on a homeless organization practices board, praxis housing and i was recruited, you know, maybe not because i am an entrepreneur, but they know me because i was actually doing work with them. What do they have you doing? What expertise air you providing? So this is really interesting and what i love about being on the boards, it’s, that i like to step into a role that i don’t do within my company. So i am a marketing expert. I’ve never taken on marketing the marketing committee, i do not have fund-raising experience and that’s the committee that i decided to chair. Oh, okay, but they would have recruited you in part for your expertise. No, but they’re not tapping that marketing expertise. So in this particular case, they recruited me partially because i’m a consensus builder on yes, i do have marketing expertise, and i will obviously bring that in and help them in particular social media expertise, but it was not on that committee in the morning. I may bring it in because i’m a blogger, so i may be blogging about my experience as helping diversify this particular non-profits revenue streams, okay, so but in your case, it was mme or your skill as a consensus builder. Yeah, that because you mentioned that one of the things that entrepreneurs bring is some some ex, some expertise, and in your case, it was largely the consensus building. So this particular non-profit had just come through a rough pat patch, and many people would have been oh, my god, no, i can’t go on the board, you know, bad things that just happened to them. The ceo, you know? Ah, ah, you know, left the organization entrepreneurs are unafraid of that kind of stuff. They don’t mind messy things, and i’ve been in messy things. I’ve persevered and figured it out. As you know, it’s, a czar mentioned entrepreneurs are creative problem solvers and one way that i happen to do it is through people skills other people may use other skills, but in my case, it’s people skills so important to recognize that the entrepreneur is multidemensional and not just the sum of what’s written on a resume in terms of their own business experience. Absolutely. And as i said, they deliberately recruited may because they wanted sort of my personality. Okay, well, you’re a lovely person. I can see that. Thank you. S so let’s, get back to the non-profit generally starting to approach this s o this two way street, we know entrepreneurs are not reaching out as much as we might like to non-profits to seek boardmember ship, what can non-profits due to start tio approach entrepreneurs so i would first look in my own backyard. So what i mean by that is look to your donors and to your volunteers, so they are already passionate about your non-profit because they’re working with you’re giving money with to you, you’re seeing them in action. So you know what you like about them and you’re seeing whether there would be an additional fit in sort of upping their commitment, which would be to get on the board. Are we looking on? Lee at major donors, when we’re looking at our donors, i would say that you might first look at the low hanging fruit, which is major donors, but as you’re moving your donors up the pipeline your minor league donors to you were always trying to cultivate them and become bigger donors. You may see a diamond in the rough, and you may decide that that diamond would be best cultivated through board experience rather than, you know, upping the dollar commitment and people might be showing their commitment through smaller gif ts but very consistent, maybe many years they’ve been giving, but not at a level that you write call a major gift, right? And there’s also mohr tio the things that an entrepreneur can do for you, it’s not just about money, it could be the expertise that’s really critical as we as we talked about, okay, we’re live tweeting. The show has always used hashtag non-profit radio to join the conversation on twitter with jerry stengel she’s founder of venture near, which is spelled venture, and then n e r, which you’ll find it venture near dot com we’re talking about entrepreneurs on your board, all right? So aside from looking in your internal database, how can we start to identify entrepreneurs? So there are some online resource is that you can use borden it yusa is one of them. You may go to your local umbrella organization. Okay, let me stop you there. What is what is bored net us a do? So borden it yusa is data bus and it’s about a non-profit being able teo, utilize the database to find the expertise that they need on their board. So i guess the first step for the non-profit would be to do an assessment, what skills do they need? And then they can actually, you know, screen by financial expertise, legal expertise, marketing expertise to find people in their geographic area. Okay, how do we after we’ve mined our own data? So we’ve found major donors or maybe consistent, smaller donors, but and how do we find out who’s an entrepreneur? We’ve got this group of committed donors, but how do we know who among them are the entrepreneurs that we want to start to target? So if you have a good database, i hope you know that in your database, so you’re not you’re not, you know, some are some do not have that don’t have business. They just know that they get a check every year, but they don’t have the business background of the person. So all right, so absent that come on, jerry strangle, you know, you know, so i’m going down for the for the small shit can you can’t drill down. One of the ways that you can drill down is put that name in tow linked in. Okay, so one of my favorite ways of finding ah, perspective boardmember is that’s actually the use linkedin? Because you can search by you can use linkedin it’s an amazing database of professional managerial people, and you can screen people by geographic area by whether they’re in entrepreneur by the size of company, by the industry on dh find even people that are passionate about your cause because they now have a section in which you can tell people, you know what? The cause that you care about, okay? All right, so we’ve got the names we have linked in. Is this an advanced search that you’re talking about in lincoln or a standard search? How do we actually do the search to run these names from our own database to find out who the entrepreneurs are it is an advanced search, but they’re advanced search is very using user friendly. So you’re just filling out a form. So it was just a checklist of things. Okay, how do you get it? First of all, advanced search is available in the free linked in service, right? Absolutely part of free. Okay. And how do you get into advanced search where’s? That so i think in the upper right hand corner there’s the box that says search and right underneath that they’ll be ah, hi protects link, teo advanced search click on that and then the form pops up and you’re literally just completing a form. Okay? And what would we be looking? What what attributes would we be looking forward to? See? Well, at one point were just looking at names because we got names from a general database, but suppose suppose now we’re beyond that. We’ve mined our own data and gone toe linked in to confirm who’s an entrepreneur who’s not, but beyond that now we’re trying to find new entrepreneurs that we don’t know what we do on linked in tow, identify them so again you can fill out the form because they’re gonna have a Job title on 1 of the job titles, i believe, is entrepreneur, but if it isn’t, then you could do president of the company and you’re just picking a size a company because i know they have size of company. They do have industry so you can pick up by industry and i’m not sure if they have job function. They might have job function also. Okay. Andan other possible title. Besides, president might be founder, right? Like you’re found your deshele founder venture near you ventured years our company again. Okay, so linked in very underutilized. And you were on that panel. That was the december twenty third show. So if people want to know more about using linked in which that panel jerry was part of felt is the most underutilized social media. Then listen to the go back and listen to the december twenty third show. Devoted teo devoted to link, then. Okay. Other other resource is besides borden at yusa linked in so again local umbrella organizations like united way here in new york, we have board serve. N y c, which is done by united way. We have the junior league new york city, which trains people to become board members. Andi also mentioned palindrome advisors, right? Palindrome otto. You know, i mentioned otto because that’s altum pantene organization, which i was president, i was found her off. I was an entrepreneur at, like, fourteen, fourteen, fifteen years old was was founder of otto, where i grew up altum pantene organization, otto, i love palindromes. I also love liberations, but that’s for another show. So how do we approach these people now? We’ve identified who they are using. These resource is how do we get to them? So in the case of linked in, what you might do is have an intermediate person, somebody that you know, who knows them, make that introduction if you don’t know somebody because you’re passionate about the same thing sort of cold emailing them is not something that’s going to offend them, you know, you’re talking to them about something that they particularly care about. That could be poverty that could be animals. It could be whatever that non-profit is about. And you’re saying you care about animals and that’s what? We’re all about can we have a discussion? And email is actually on linked in. A lot of people have their email address unlinked in or you could use a lincoln message, i guess. Yeah. So there’s a couple of different ways you can have somebody make that introduction on. Then if you pay for link clearly that’s preferred if you have a warm, warm reduction warm introduction, right? Always a warm introduction is better than a cult introductions. If you have a list of names, you might run that list by your board, major donors and see if they know any of these potential boardmember yeah, i’m going to say the chances are the staff maybe doing that screening for you there’s ways and linked in that you would be able to know where the overlapping people are in which boardmember knows the person that you want to contact. Okay. All right. How do you do that? Quickly? How do you do that? Quickly? We just have a couple of minutes, but leave the detail hanging. How would you find those overlaps? So oh, god, you’re really putting me on the spot. And i have to think this through. You know, i can’t come up, yeah, facebook page. All right, so we’ll put it on the facebook jerry’s going to post on our facebook page, which is facebook dot com, of course, and then the name of the show how to make thes overlap findings on linked in. Okay, so now you’ve approached the person you start the you start the conversation? Absolutely, and part of the conversation might be an in person meeting and it’s really get to know you meeting, and that first thing is again to confirm passion alignment. So the most important thing is that they care about the mission of your organisation, and then we have to start to convey those expectations that you mentioned earlier and the next thing that we would talk about it’s really the time commitment buy-in and then after that, i would talk about what the duties are, so if they’ve never been on, if the entrepreneur has never been on the board, what fiduciary legal ethical responsibilities does the person have? What they may not realize is it’s the board’s responsibility toe hyre and evaluate the ceo, edie of the non-profit it’s the board’s responsibility to review and approve the budget in many non-profits cases. It’s, not the board’s job to do the work of the organization. I’m gonna leave with our last poll question, which was, if you do have entrepreneurs on your board, how are they working out for you? One hundred percent said they are above average board members. Validation of everything jerry strangle is telling us you should be on should be searching for entrepreneurs. Jerry is the founder of venture near offering social enterprises non-profits in small business media, small businesses, advice from professional advisors and piers with real world experience venture near dot com is the domain. Jerry, thanks very much for being in studio guest. Thank you. It was a pleasure. Please stay with me when we returned. Tony’s, take two. Yeah, you’re listening to the talking alternative network. Are you feeling overwhelmed in the current chaos of our changing times? A deeper understanding of authentic astrology can uncover solutions in every area of life. After all, metaphysics is just quantum physics, politically expressed on montgomery taylor, and i offer lectures, seminars and private consultations. For more information, contact me at monte m o nt. Y at r l j media. Dot com are you stuck in your business or career trying to take your business to the next level, and it keeps hitting a wall? This is sam liebowitz, the conscious consultant. I will help you get to the root cause of your abundance issues and help move you forward in your life. Call me now and let’s. Create the future you dream of. Two, one, two, seven, two, one, eight, one, eight, three, that’s to one to seven to one, eight one eight three. The conscious consultant helping conscious people. Be better business people. Hey, all you crazy listeners looking to boost your business? Why not advertise on talking alternative with very reasonable rates? Interested simply email at info at talking alternative dot com welcome back to time for tony’s take two on my block this week, my next-gen charity two thousand eleven interviews part for and the last part, sadly, my show was a social was a media sponsor of the next-gen charity conference last november here in new york city, and i got a dozen excellent, insightful, thoughtful interviews from the speakers there and the last three are linked on my block this week, abby falik is the ceo of global citizen year, and she and i talked about innovation and the leadership to envision it and drive it forward. Eric sacristan wants you to pursue your hero’s journey his journey took him across the country, meeting two hundred of the world’s, most influential and powerful people over a cup of coffee. Andi learned, you know, amazing lessons from these two hundred people on dh made a film about it called the journey it’s, a disney document documentary chronicling him driving across country with a vw. I think it was yellow. I’ve seen the video, i’ve seen the journey, i’m pretty sure he had a yellow vw microbus, which broke down a couple of times, and you watched him struggle for funding. To get the the vw fixed on dh to continue making his journey across country. And you also see him in phone booths calling some of the most influential people in the country, inviting them to a cup of coffee because that’s all he could afford to take them out too. And jacob are men in is a director at the x prize foundation, and he explains how the x prize motivates people and he wants you to make space to dream. So links to these interviews and the first nine of the twelve are on my block at tony martignetti dot com note the new earl for the blogged tony martignetti dot com that’s tony’s take two for friday, february third, the fifth show of two thousand twelve right now, it’s starting the plan giving conversation with laurie greiff from philanthropy day at the association of fund-raising professionals, westchester county chapter and here’s. That pre recorded interview welcome to tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of national philanthropy day, hosted by the association of fund-raising professionals, westchester county chapter we’re at the edith macy conference centre in briarcliff manor, new york, and with me now is laurie graph. She is president of breakthrough philanthropy and her seminar topic is starting the plant e-giving conversation. Laurie graph welcome. Thank you. Hi, what are non-profits not doing in terms of just starting that conversation? Opening the door that you’d like them like to see them do more of, i think that they’re not making plan giving visible enough is a way to give to their organizations. People know about annual campaigns and major gifts and capital campaigns, and they’re actively marketed. But plan giving is something that people don’t think of initially when they want to make a gift. And i don’t think that non-profits bring it up enough and marketed enough. And what about the small non-profit can can the small shop be involved in plant e-giving absolutely, absolutely any non-profit that is funded by individuals and has been around for a while and has a long term mission should be doing plan giving, okay and around for a while. How long roughly should you live long enough to feel that your donors are totally committed to you? It’s very hard to say. Sometimes it could be just five years. Sometimes it might be ten years. It could even be three. Years, but if you have people who are totally committed to supporting the organization, then you should be talking to them about this kind of giving, okay on dh how do we know that they’re committed? How do we judge that? That commitment, because you’ve been talking to them all along, it’s it’s not even so much through their gifts, says through their actions, for example, you might think that someone who’s given to you for ten years is your best giver and maybe that’s the the case, but somebody who’s been volunteering consistently without even making significant gives at any point may also be a very, very good prospects. So it’s a question of knowing who you’re talking to it’s all about relationships, ok? And how about age? Is that that’s an important factor before we tryingto want to get out who we’re going to start the conversation with and then out everybody candidate at some point for playing e-giving but it depends. I think that you can talk to anyone at any point, because i have no qualms about saying to someone whose family has been committed to the organization say, a very young person who’s just gotten married just had a baby, you know you’re going to be doing a will. You might want to think about other things besides just your wife and children start building your estate now maybe you’d like to consider including us for a small piece right now and let them say yes or no, but least the thought is in their head and you have that much longer to ask them also. And for an older person while you you want to be sure that it’s not such an old age that they finished with their estate planning and they’re not going to change their will or make any changes. So it really is it’s up to the individual’s relationship, ok, eso, in terms of your seminar topic, you know, starting the plane giving conversation, who should be having the conversation? We’re not it’s, not just fundraisers, right? Not just professional fundraisers, but maybe boards or directors. Who do you like to see having these conversations? It’s fund-raising so whoever you use with your fund-raising that’s who you should be using with your plan giving, you’re already in the conversation and neither the donor is is comfortable with you or or with the exec, director or boardmember whatever their relationship connection is that’s the person you might wantto have involved with? Withy asked. On the other hand, i’ve asked many people justice, the fundraiser, but i’ve had a long term relationship with them, and they tell you the most extraordinary things, once you start that kind of conversation you just never know what’s going to come out it’s very personal. So you may be the best person in something you size up, just like any other major gift. And, you know, i may be i probably should have asked you this early on, but how do you define planned giving? What? What? What’s the scope that we’re talking about just so that listeners know what types of giving types of gifts we’re talking about? You know, it’s really not so much what i define us plan giving because the whole industry sees it in a different way in different, you know, larger organizations see it differently from smaller ones, anything that’s more complicated than writing a check, any gift from the ninety five percent of the assets that are not cash that people have, i think that that somehow touches on a plan gift? It could even be something current. I mean, people giving money from from their iras is considered a planned gift now, if you’re over seventy and a half but to me, it’s a major gift, it’s an outright cash gift so depends in terms of getting to starting that that plan giving conversation if we have volunteers who are regularly talking about fund-raising so, as you said, we want to engage them in opening the plan, giving conversation to what degree to do, volunteers need to be trained about details and technical sides of planned e-giving you don’t need the details, you need to know that the kind of gifts that come out of donors for plan gifts are generally the biggest gift they’ll make. They are commitments to legacy and making a change or an ongoing presence in the organization and that’s really all that you need to know if your volunteer talking to somebody once you get the reality of where they are with the organization, then then somebody with more experience may want to talk to them a professional. Okay, but but your seminar is about opening that door just getting the conversation started. Yes, but i was talking to a room full of professional fundraisers and amazingly, a lot of them didn’t have plan giving was just drives me nuts because it’s a huge, huge gift for anybody who does it it’s the biggest gift they’ll probably ever make, and they’re doing it to have an impact, a basic impact on the organization in the world. So, you know, it’s an important gift and it’s just beyond me, while people why people aren’t you know what it is, it’s not beyond me, actually, because people are pressed for time and this requires a tremendous amount of cultivation and getting involved and really working with donors on a long term basis. So going back to the volunteers, how do you train them? Tio, just start this conversation. What? What what words did they use? How do you teach people that gave some examples? For instance, supposing you have somebody with your organisation who doesn’t even give you a lot of money, but the volunteer to be at every every event, and then they volunteered to help out and and they’ve been doing it for years and years. What’s wrong with sang gi george, you’ve been helping us forever. You’re like part of this place already. Is there any reason you know why you don’t give money and you might say, well, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s, the action that really brings me into this, and then you say, well, no, there may be a time when you want to think about putting us in your will. So even if somebody has put off a little bit by the fact that they haven’t really been donors and now the fundraiser is asking them for a gift, there are soft ways of approaching people, anybody you could say, joan, you’ve been giving to us for years and years, and you’ve made such a different for whatever in our organization. Have you thought about putting us in your will? We’re part of your legacy, you know, something like that. The point is that you already know the people you’re talking to strangers are not going to be comfortable in this conversation, okay? So that’s the first thing that needs to be someone you’re really in the conversation? Yeah, but even if even if it is someone you know, that oh, you mean the the organization knows them. Or the person who’s doing the asking knows them or both. Well, okay, okay, but even if it is someone who has a relationship with the person, i think we’re there are still a reluctance to teo talk about someone’s a state plan. I mean, it involves death and it’s so personal and deeply private i couldn’t possibly bring myself to have this coming. I don’t mean me, but i’m the hypothetical volunteer. How can i? Yeah, i mean, how do i overcome my fear of just of raising this subject, even with somebody who i know well, you khun, speak from your heart because you’re asking for a heart felt gift. This is truly not just writing a check. It’s making a statement. So since you already know this person, the question you ask is, will you lead not? Will you leave us money when your dad but do you wanna have a continuing presence with us? Is it important for you to make an impact for the future? Do you have a vision of what you’d like this place to really look like at some point and that’s the door opener to asking for a future gift to making a real commitment to the organization, not about the person’s life ending, but about the continuation of what they think is a horton. So this is not a conversation about death? Hell, no. Okay, you can swear on tony martignetti no problem. It’s ok? We have jargon jail, but i don’t think that i think everybody knows what that means. I think that everybody knows that that that’s not a judge in jail offense, everybody knows what that means, okay? But i think that is what a lot of people’s reluctance is built around there, and they’re going to talk about the person’s dying and death, but now it’s about their legacy to the non-profit they love, right? Absolutely. And i mean, they’re no different than anybody else. The person you’re talking to wasn’t the only one who’s going to die. Everybody is so that shouldn’t be the issue the issue should be. How do you want to be remembered? And you don’t even have to say it that way. It’s it’s what you want people to see that you’ve done in the future? What would you like your name to be on? Or what would you like your legacy to be for everyone, you know, and i appreciate going know that level of detail. May we really what what words do you do we use? Do you recommend? Because that is helpful to people who have this reluctance? I’m with laurie graph she’s, the president of breakthrough philanthropy, and we’re talking about her seminar topic at national philanthropy day in westchester county, starting the plan giving conversation. So what other advice do you have for people who are i want to be starting this conversation, but are are either and technically challenged or just for some kind of, you know, have a reluctance? Well, it has to be someone who’s been fund-raising for a while, i don’t think even even a more senior person who’s in an administrative job can do it. You have to be usedto asking people for money or for assistance in some way, and you need to have the relationships. But the the best thing i can say and this is going to sound funny is practice. I mean, i’ve practiced in front of a computer camera where i’m looking at me soliciting me for a plan gift, and and everyone knows that when you first start doing something, even if you know how to do it, you’re awkward, and then you’re less awkward, and then then you’re doing it, and you’re good at it. So it’s, like asking for money for anything, how about practicing with with someone else in the office, a sort of a role play that’s. Good if you can keep from giggling. Okay, well, you khun, giggle and swear with long, you don’t do that in the actual leader. You want to get so fluent in this that it’s just coming out of your mouth, as you’re saying, and it’s natural and you’re comfortable, okay, and then, eh? So we’re talking about. We’ve been talking about asking the question, talking alternative radio, twenty four hours a day. Hi, i’m carol ward from the body mind wellness program. Listen to my show for ideas and information to help you live a healthier life in body, mind and spirit. You hear from terrific guests who are experts in the areas of health, wellness and creativity. So join me every thursday at eleven a, m eastern standard time on talking alternative dot com professionals serving community. This is tony martignetti aptly named host of tony martignetti non-profit radio. Big non-profit ideas for the other ninety five percent technology fund-raising compliance, social media, small and medium non-profits have needs in all these areas. My guests are expert in all these areas and mohr. Tony martignetti non-profit radio fridays one to two eastern on talking alternative broadcasting are you concerned about the future of your business for career? Would you like it all to just be better? Well, the way to do that is to better communication, and the best way to do that is training from the team at improving communications. This is larry sharp, host of the ivory tower radio program and director at improving communications. Does your office needs better leadership, customer service sales or maybe better writing are speaking skills. Could they be better at dealing with confrontation conflicts, touchy subjects all are covered here at improving communications. If you’re in the new york city area, stopped by one of our public classes or get your human resource is in touch with us. Website is improving communications, dot com that’s improving communications, dot com improve your professional environment, be more effective, be happier and make more money. Improving communications, that’s. The answer. Talking. Now, let’s spend little time dealing with the response suppose the responses i’ve never thought of it and, you know, i’m just not i don’t think it’s right for me? I don’t think it’s right for me, okay, i could get that, and certainly if you have a specific objection to two, including a charity, when you’ve been so generous your whole life, i would want to know what that is just because i like you and i’ve known you for years, and i’m curious, and we’re not asking you to just disown your family or take anything away from anything that’s already important, we want to be part of what’s important. So, you know, is there some way i can help you with this, or is there a personal bias? I mean, you just have to pursue what that isthe and in asking those important follow-up questions, i think you’re going to find out a lot about the person’s objection, and maybe that will help you overcome it. The difference is, tony, that when you ask somebody for a plan gift you’re asking for ah future commitment so it’s not like saying to someone we want you to leave. Us one hundred thousand dollars from your will, or a million dollars from your will. I’m sure there were people who were very good at asking that way, but i’ll restart with you’ve been so committed to our program, you’ve been doing this and this and this for so many years, and i know you especially love x what’s your vision for that for the future. Is there some way you would want to have an impact on that and that’s more of a way to go, then? Just it’s really listening to what the donor says? Very donor-centric yeah, well and listen, right. So asking good questions and follow-up teo to someone who objects and then listening carefully. You’re, as you said, teaches you a lot, right, i think, and just doing it, doing it and doing it makes you better and better. Okay, what other advice did you did you have to share with with your seminar today? Well, to bite the bullet and do it because this is the first practice for, well, that’s part of doing it is getting it down and getting it right and feeling comfortable and at some point making it the rial. Thing don’t just keep practising and practising billions and billions of dollars come into non-profits every year, just from bequests, somewhere between seven and nine percent of all e-giving going back decades, so if you’re not willing to tap into that resource, what possible excuse could you have we’ve been talking about, including the organization in a will can we open the conversation about some other type of plan to gift? Absolutely absolutely would you have to do is listen to the donor, because if the donor has other needs that our priority or better fit what they can do for your organization, it’s worth discussing thie easiest is a request and about eighty percent of all plan gifts or bequests, but there are certainly other ways that might help the donor make the gift. Okay? And so then how do we pursue those other types of gift that might be a little more sophisticated? Not grossly, you know, terribly non-technical but might be a little more sophisticated. How do we shepherd are our conversation? Teo, teo, continue it, but when we don’t really know what might be the right avenue, just that we have a donor was interested and there might be some other playing gift method that’s, that’s appropriate. Where do we go in while we’re in our conversation? Well, you have to explore the donor’s going to tell you things when you’re in this kind of conversation that you might never hear from them otherwise. So if somebody is more concerned about taking care of their son with a disability or if they’re worried about education for their kids and giving the money away at some point before the kids were out of school, thes air all things that could be dealt with through trusts or other instruments and listening to what concerns the donor helps and and and what calls to the donor also is what helps you decide. You know what? I may have something that will actually help you do better than you thought, but i want to check my numbers so i’m goingto call you tonight or something like that in this way, it gives you a chance to talk to more sophisticated people as faras the techniques go, and if you know the techniques yourself, you couldn’t throw it out and see what they say there was something i was really kind. Of burning to ask you and now i forgot it was it was directly related to something you just said, well, maybe you’ll come to me, so i just have to ask you generally then what? What other advice did you share in your talk today? That was it that was it really well, it was pretty much not to just sit back and assume that everything you’re doing is going to keep you in the loop, because plan giving is the future of technically and also virtually the future of all non-profits they have to be doing it in some way. And mom, my pitch was to just do it. If you’re raising money from people and not institutions, get on the phone, make appointments and do it, and not be fearful of the rejection of the objections of your fundraiser. So these things happen. I actually gave a simple hand out it’s, a list that set on the top low hanging fruit make your list. Who were you going to call when you get back to the office tomorrow? Who’s the first person you’re going to mention this to how are you going to get this started? And your organization may be you have to talk to your boss or the chairman of the borders somebody and sell it to them, give them the case for plan giving because you need it. I remember what i was going to ask you now. You said that, uh, a lot of times you’ll hear things that people will never share in any other, any other conversation, obviously, without attributing it. What? What are what are a couple things that you’ve heard that you think our personal that you wouldn’t have been able to find out if you hadn’t? If you hadn’t opened the plant e-giving conversation? Well, something’s a really personal, like, you know, where we’re very worried about a son that you’ve never met who’s been having some issues, and we want to be sure we have a trust set up for him and that also, by the way, is an opening for a charitable gift as well. Or you might hear, you’re not going to believe this. I just want latto i did actually do that from somebody in massachusetts, and so there are various different things somebody could sadio it’s not public yet, but george and i are getting divorced things come up that you would never know and you never really have to know unless you’re getting into family issues and then people tell you things and you become their best friend so all these reasons it’s it’s worth doing just get out. Oh, it’s great for dahna relations. It just makes your donors feel very attached to you. Lori graph is the president of breakthrough philanthropy and we’ve been talking about opening are starting the plan giving conversation. Laurie graph thank you very much for being a guest. Thank you, tony it’s. Been a pleasure. This is tony martignetti non-profit radio coverage of national philanthropy day hosted by the association of not of fund-raising professionals. Westchester county chapter. That was my interview with lori greiff. And i’m very grateful to her, by the way, at the conference, i was mispronouncing her name it’s greiff, my thanks to her. And to the organizers of westchester county a f p and also to jerry strangle my first guest today next week. Psychic medium betsy cohen. Yes, a psychic medium is going to take your calls and tweets to help your office overcome challenges and learn more about itself, plus two next-gen charity interviews one with marc ecko, the founder of eco enterprises. You may very well be wearing one of his pullovers. You’ve certainly seen them and also craig mark, the founder of craigslist and craigconnects keep up with what’s coming up. Sign up for our insider email alerts on the facebook page. If you like the show, please like the page, you know you can listen. Live our archive to listen archive goto itunes you’ll find us there at non-profit radio dot net on twitter you can follow me, you can follow the show’s hashtag, which is non-profit radio the show is sponsored by g grace and company. Are you worried about the rising cost of rent for your organization? Do you need a plan for real estate that you’re non-profit owns g grace and company will give you and your board full analysis so you’re real estate decisions are made transparently and thoroughly. George grace has been advising non-profits on their real estate decisions for over twenty five years. Gee greys dot com or eight, eight, eight, seven, four seven double two thirty seven. Our creative producer was claire meyerhoff, our line producer. 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